Icon keywords

[aresvallis]

Title:
Icon keywords

Area:
Icons

Summary:
The icon keywords are an old and outdated system, it'd be easier for users if a better management system was put in place, especially for high numbers of icons.

Description:
Icon keywords really need to be updated. It is difficult and cumbersome managing keywords for icons especially when having a high number of icons. The current system has literally not changed much since 2001. It would be nice having a sort of keyword managing place, one where you could assign icons (and drag and drop would be awesome there!) or rename or merge keywords as you can for entry tags. Additionally, keeping a list of keywords that you've used but don't currently have an icon assigned would be helpful and useful to roleplayers. Even if it's just a static list would let the user see what they've used. As denise said here:
http://dw-biz.dreamwidth.org/7186.html?thread=773394#cmt773394
it might be computationally expensive getting a retroactive list from old comments, I'd suggest not doing that though and just adding a old keyword if someone actively views a comment with an old keyword- it would be looking for that icon anyway and it'd just display the default when it doesn't find it, though I'm not familiar with how the process works exactly.

Poll #9952 Icon keywords

Open to: Registered Users, detailed results viewable to: All, participants: 53

View Respondents

This suggestion:

View Answers

Should be implemented as-is.
12 (22.6%)

Should be implemented with changes. (please comment)
9 (17.0%)

Shouldn't be implemented.
8 (15.1%)

(I have no opinion)
23 (43.4%)

(Other: please comment)
1 (1.9%)

Edit!!!! In order to clarify + additional:

It is extremely awkward managing keywords from the icon page from a little tiny text area box, particularly when having many large sets of keywords on one icon with only commas as a separator. I suggest a separate manage area for a list of icon keywords currently in use, and possibly a list of keywords used in the past for reference and the ability to reassign old keywords to new icons. People do not always remember exactly the way they typed a keyword they don't actually have saved.

We have a management page for entry tags, where we can delete, rename, merge and view what is tagged to a specific entry tag. I am suggesting something similar for keywords- if not their own page, at least a section on the icon upload page where we do not have to deal with the tiny text area and only the text area. I can see being able to select a keyword with a check box and hitting a "Rename" button to be able to rename keywords, or select two keywords via check box and hit a "merge" button, or select some "delete" button. Then possibly an "add new keyword" button. That would make keywords more manageable and I don't think it'd require a lot of work, and we already have a check-and-hit-button to delete icons themselves.

We can only rename keywords, we cannot merge them. I've tried to merge keywords, and it didn't work. There is no obvious option nor way to merge keywords. Trying to rename one into another fails. -This is on Bugzilla and is already on the to-do list, but it's part of the bigger management system, so I thought I should include it.

Renaming keywords is sort of a hit or miss using the text area on the icon page, especially if there are multiple keywords to an icon. You do not know if the rename was successful until you go to check comments made with the old keyword- there is absolutely no confirmation, and it is far too easy to typo and create a horrible Frankenkeyword out of the one you're trying to rename and one of the others. Then it becomes annoying trying to undo that because there is no undo button, either, and you have to figure out what keyword you renamed, fix the innocent keyword, and try to rename the suspect keyword again.

This is the same old tired system that has been in use since LiveJournal's early days: By that, I am implying: surely with new coding and technology we should be able to have a more dynamic, easy to use icon and keyword management option.

Comments

[aresvallis]

1. No, we can only rename keywords, we cannot merge them. I've tried to merge keywords, and it didn't work. There is no obvious option nor way to merge keywords. Trying to rename one into another fails.

2. Renaming keywords is sort of a hit or miss using the text area on the icon page, especially if there are multiple keywords to an icon. You do not know if the rename was successful until you go to check comments made with the old keyword- there is absolutely no confirmation, and it is far too easy to typo and create a horrible Frankenkeyword out of the one you're trying to rename and one of the others. Then it becomes annoying trying to undo that because there is no undo button, either, and you have to figure out what keyword you renamed, fix the innocent keyword, and try to rename the suspect keyword again.

3. It is extremely awkward managing keywords from the icon page from a little tiny text area box, particularly when having many large sets of keywords on one icon with only commas as a separator. I suggest a separate manage area for a list of icon keywords currently in use, and possibly a list of keywords used in the past for reference and the ability to reassign old keywords to new icons. People do not always remember exactly the way they typed a keyword they don't actually have saved.

4. We have a management page for entry tags, where we can delete, rename, merge and view what is tagged to a specific entry tag. I am suggesting something similar for keywords- if not their own page, at least a section on the icon upload page where we do not have to deal with the tiny text area. I can see being able to select a keyword with a check box and hitting a "Rename" button to be able to rename keywords, or select two keywords via check box and hit a "merge" button, or select some "delete" button. Then possibly an "add new keyword" button. That would make keywords more manageable, and we already have a check-and-hit-button to delete icons themselves.

5. This is the same old tired system that has been in use since LiveJournal's early days. Surely with new coding and technology we should be able to have a more dynamic, easy to use icon and keyword management option.

[jumpuphigh]

You are right. Merging isn't currently possible. I thought there was a bug in bugzilla for that though.

[aresvallis]

Yeah, I know about the bugzilla thing, but that isn't something the average user can access/would know how to access easily.

[denise]

Something being in Bugzilla doesn't mean that someone can use it if they want to, it means that there's a bug logged into our bug tracking system for a developer to add it to the site for everybody sometime in the future! (Essentially, what jumpuphigh was saying was, icon keyword merging is already on the to-do list.)

[aresvallis]

Ahh all right. I wasn't sure whether Bugzilla was something you could actually do.

Is it possible to edit the suggestion and include the follow-up comment?

[denise]

You can edit the entry, yes! Any edits you make to the entry won't carry over to the version that gets put into Bugzilla for implementation if the suggestion is accepted (unless you mark it really clearly as an edit in nice big bold letters and it catches my eye for me to manually update it -- much of the process is automated and when I'm moving suggestions into Bugzilla for implementation I tend to go on a nice meditative point-click-point-click autopilot). However, suggestions like this, ones that would need a lot of design work if they're migrated into Bugzilla, will have designers/developers reading the original suggestion and the comments left to it to think about how they should design it, so it's not totally urgent to make the edits; anyone who'd implement it or do the design work for it would be reading the followup as well.

[aresvallis]

Okay, I'm just worried that people will reject it, because they're confused or I didn't explain it well enough, before they read the comments. I'll be editing it now.

I've been a little bit all over the place because I pinched a nerve in my back recently...

[denise]

Oh, ick. I deal with stuff like that all the time because of my various disability stuff; it's never pleasant! I hope you feel better quickly (or at least that you're getting the good drugs)

[aresvallis]

Ohhh don't worry about me, yoga and stretching should take care of it.

[denise]

Still! I hope it gets better fast. :)

[aresvallis]

Thanks <3

[azurelunatic]

I would not worry *much* too much about rejection -- dw_suggestions is not actually a democracy, so while the poll measures general sentiment, votes can also be changed, and the owners reserve the right to decide what they actually think is the best thing to do, not just what gathered community approval in the original suggestion. :)

[jumpuphigh]

Thanks, denise. It's way too many hours past my bedtime and while I'm clear in my own head, things aren't translating from brain to keyboard as well as I'd like.

[erik]

I see. What threw me off was misunderstanding your first sentence:
"The icon keywords are an old and outdated system, it'd be easier for users if a better management system was put in place, especially for high numbers of icons."

I took that to mean you were looking to completely replace the keyword system with something else; a different way of managing icons. I now understand that you are looking to replace the keyword management system with something a little less like a command line and more like drag-n-drop?

[aresvallis]

Yes, I'm sorry if my wording confused you. The management system is what I meant. I thought it would be obvious I was talking about the way keywords are managed, but reading it again I can see how it'd be mistaken, though I wouldn't say drag-and-drop per se. The option for drag-and-drop, definitely.