No rename token for purged communities

[tenkuu]

Title:
No rename token for purged communities

Area:
communities, rename tokens

Summary:
A purged username that someone wants to use as a community should not require a rename token.

Description:
Communities shouldn't need rename tokens because they're not a newly created username like someone would have for their own personal journal. Once purged, if a username can be used as a community, it should be as easy to claim it as for any newly created community. After all, purged should mean that it no longer has any association with its previous owner, and in this way it's like any regular unclaimed username.

Poll #2674 No rename token for purged communities

Open to: Registered Users, detailed results viewable to: All, participants: 47

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This suggestion:

View Answers

Should be implemented as-is.
6 (12.8%)

Should be implemented with changes. (please comment)
1 (2.1%)

Shouldn't be implemented.
32 (68.1%)

(I have no opinion)
8 (17.0%)

(Other: please comment)
0 (0.0%)

Comments

[tenkuu]

Then should I add that to the details of my suggestion? Ie, that a purged username should at least have its own page completely empty? Also, that a purged username should have some way to differentiate between a comment made by the old owner and the new? Or perhaps that all posts made by the previous owner should be, as the name implies, well and truly purged by simply having them be automatically erased?

But either way, what you mentioned would be a concern even if one were to purchase a rename token for such a purged account, so it doesn't directly relate to the rename token issue.

[ratcreature]

Huh? I just didn't understand what the community part of your suggestion has to do with anything. As I pointed out, picking a "purged" username is not the same as choosing username that has never existed, and that that username still needs extra work before it is ready to be used again, for communities and regular accounts alike. And I don't see why this ought to happen to every "purged" account, i.e. with the purging rather than the reusing. It makes sense to only go through the trouble if someone else wants to use that name, whereas the majority of purged names is not of any interest to anyone so there is no need for that work.

[tenkuu]

It's just that when you create a community, it's different from registering a new username.

I understood perfectly what you were pointing out, and that is why I wrote the explanation that I did. What do you mean though, you don't see why it ought to happen to every purged account? A purged account no longer has the same owner, that's why.

People who work for Dreamwidth certainly have more resources than regular users, so if it is a lot of work to completely purge an account, it would be much easier for them to do it.

But what kind of logic is that, anyway? Purge a username so that someone else might be able to use it in the future, but then have the mentality that most of them won't be used anyway. That makes no sense. Not only that, it isn't a very nice thing to say, and just because you don't know someone who would like to use a purged username.

[yvi]

It's just that when you create a community, it's different from registering a new username.

How?

You say Communities shouldn't need rename tokens because they're not a newly created username like someone would have for their own personal journal

But they are. They are a newly created account with a username, just like a personal account.

[tenkuu]

Because a community does not work the same as a regular username. You manage a community under your current username.

When you register a new username, you will not be asked for a rename token.

[kyrielle]

A community is still an account and still exists at that name on Dreamwidth, even though it's not a person. Regardless of the type of account, the "space" it was in has to be cleaned.

To run with that as an analogy, it's not whether the apartment will contain a family or a business - it's whether the apartment previously contained something else and needs cleaning.

And in many cases the user name that was deleted and purged (the "apartment") is not desirable enough that anyone wants to use it again, so taking on the cleaning fees for it at the outset isn't worth it. If someone wants it, then the cleaning has to be done, and any cleaning fees dealt with - regardless of who/what is moving in.

[tenkuu]

I don't think the analogy is right... A regular username is more like a family, and a community is like a family member. Not unimportant, but part of the unit.

Actually, apartments get used because of usefulness more than desirability. But either way, with your analogy, the apartment needs to be cleaned in case it should be used again.

[kyrielle]

In terms of who's at the keyboard, yes. But a user name is a "space" and its prior activity, not its new activity, determines what use cleaning up is.

Why take the overhead of cleaning up all links, comments, etc., in a way that preserves them but doesn't tie them to the new owner if there is no new owner? How many purged usernames are ever reclaimed? A lot of usernames aren't something someone else would want, only the original owner. If cleanup were cheap and easy, then sure, but if it were then I don't think there'd even be a question of rename tokens in the first place.

[tenkuu]

I get your point. However, if it is that rare, then it's all the more reason not to ask someone to pay for a rename token to have an account fully purged.

[yvi]

When you try to register a purged username, yes, you are.

[tenkuu]

Someone who registers a new account won't pay for a purged username, they'll just use a different but similar username. Biggest turn-off for registering to a website is having to pay.

[yvi]

Okay, I really don't get your point then.

[tenkuu]

As in the original thread I started, my point is simply that we shouldn't have to pay for a purged account.

[yvi]

Yes, but you specifically single out communities. I don't get that line of reasoning.

[tenkuu]

Not specifically, no. But I mentioned communities because there was one purged username that I was interested in registering as a community.

[yvi]

Not specifically, no.

Seriously? The whole suggestion is titled "No rename token for purged communities", you said "Communities shouldn't need rename tokens because they're not a newly created username like someone would have for their own personal journal" and "Because a community does not work the same as a regular username".

I am letting this go now, but let me say that you did not, in my opinion, make clear what you meant.

[azurelunatic]

If anything, for this suggestion to make sense, it would be "Purged usernames that were previously used as a community should be freely available, because communities do not leave comments nor do they have old entries in other communities".

[yvi]

*nods* I didn't think of that, but yes, that might have made sense.

[tenkuu]

That doesn't make as much sense as you think; it's only easier to implement. I'll give you my own example for a username I wanted for a community. "dgrayman" is a username that has been deleted and purged, and I don't know for sure, but it seems to have been a personal account. D.Gray-Man is a popular series that has a manga and had an anime that covered most of the manga but ended. Several people still follow the manga though, as it's published monthly in Japan. That is why I'm interested in making a community of that name, because the series is one of my favorites.