Cut tags should stay cut (even when on single entry pages)

[libitina]

Title:
Cut tags should stay cut (even when on single entry pages)

Area:
entries

Summary:
Currently, the cut tag affects pages that could have more than one entry. I'd like to suggest that cut tags apply to the entry view as well

Description:
Original request (entered as support request #2218):
Is there an html necessary reason why cut tags only work when viewed through a filter?

For example, http://libitina.dreamwidth.org/311800.html (IMO) should take me to a page with a cut tag, and only http://libitina.dreamwidth.org/311800.html#cutid1 should take me to the complete entry.

So, sure, my friendslist is a filter, so it stays nicely uncluttered, but it'd be nice to go to an entry with multiple cut tags and be able to navigate from the 1st one to the 5th one without the gymnastics of finding an easy filter for that page so I can read the text of the cut tags OR remembering the order of the cut tags so I can slip the right number into the URL.

Additional request:
And if you can make this work, I would love for it to be flagged to go upstream for livejournal. Thank you.

<user name="ysobel">'s reply:
Cut tags were originally created so that the content of one entry wouldn't necessarily affect other entries on the page. For example, if someone you subscribe to posts a large image, that will stretch out all of the entries on your reading page, but if they put it behind a cut tag, it won't cause problems.

Because of this, the cut tag affects pages that could have more than one entry. This includes reading pages, your journal page, the tag page if the entry is tagged, and the day page (http://libitina.dreamwidth.org/2009/07/14/). The entry/comment page, because it only has one entry on it, displays the full content.

If you'd like to suggest that cut tags apply to the entry view as well, please see the FAQ referenced above, which describes the process for suggestions.

My response -
Yes, please! I would love this as an improvement.

Poll #857

Open to: Registered Users, detailed results viewable to: All, participants: 64

View Respondents

This suggestion:

View Answers

Should be implemented as-is.
1 (1.6%)

Should be implemented with changes.
27 (42.2%)

Shouldn't be implemented.
34 (53.1%)

(Other: please comment)
2 (3.1%)

Comments

[cheyinka]

I like the idea of being able to link someone to a page that has the cut tags (for example, if the tag is being used as an impromptu content warning, or for people who don't include the text of the tag in what's hidden by the tag) but I don't like it nearly enough to want to lose the current behavior (the direct link to the entry shows the whole entry).

Maybe something that can be added to the link, like 28561.html?style=cut or something? (I don't know how that'd work with style=mine and style=light, though.)

[ysobel]

+1

I don't know that the default behaviour should be changed -- or, to be honest, I don't want it to change because I'm lazy and don't want to have to do an extra click every time -- but having it as an URL-argument option would be *awesome*. style wouldn't work because it's not a style thing and because of mine/light, but, I don't know. ?cut=1 or ?format=cut or something.

[exor674]

If you go this way, I'd prefer ?cut=true or the like -- because ?style= is way overloaded -- but everything on it is.. mutually exclusive currently, ?style=cut wouldn't be mutually exclusive anymore.

[cheyinka]

?cut=true is exactly the kind of thing I was trying to think of.

[galateus]

?cut=true... I like it! *votes "implemented with changes"*

Maybe also allow signed-in users to change the default ?cut= value, so they don't have to use Greasemonkey to edit all the links they click.

[susanreads]

Yes, a new argument like ?cut=true could be useful. It would be a lot easier to remember than the currently-available method of linking to the day page.

Definitely only as an option, though - the default behaviour is too well established to change.

[afuna]

I like this!

[triadruid]

?cut=true seems a very clean way to do this as an additional design feature, but the default should stay as it is.

[queenbarwench]

Additional vote for the ?cut=true method, with default behaviour remaining as-is.

[velocitygrass]

Default behavior should stay the same but ?cut=true would be a nice option to have.

[cesy]

Yes. I don't want the current behaviour to change, but adding cut=true as an option would be fine.

[cheyinka]

I don't want the default behavior to change, either. But I like the idea of this being possible.

[turlough]

I'm tentatively in favour of this solution.

[melannen]

+1

I want a way to scroll through lots of entries without worrying about cuts, and I want to be easily able to click through to full entries/follow links to full entries, so I want to keep the current system --

but it would also be really nice to be able to link to the cut version and have it link to only that entry. The cut tags are often an important part of the structure of the entry and have extra info; as it is, people who don't see the entry on an flist miss all of that.

I've been working around it by linking to the day page in the archive, but with more than one entry a day, that doesn't work well either.

It would be *really* cool if someone could set the default for their journal, so that links to the plain URL either would or wouldn't go to the cut version for that journal.

[zvi]

If you're using a dayview to show entry 1234.html, it has an ID of entry-1234, so you can link to the correct entry on the dayview.

[7rin]

*nods* This is what I use if I want to link to the cut version of a post.

[rho]

My thoughts exactly.

[kyrielle]

+1. This. I prefer to read entries whole, not cut, so I hit the title/link to go to the full thing. The last thing I want is to have to hit the stupid cut tags again to see what's behind them - I want the whole page and I want to start at the top. Give me a way to still get that, preferably the same one I already use; I don't mind a separate page that does have cut tags if that's what you want. (But, except when linking a friend who might want warnings before grabbing a large pic or whatever, I wouldn't ever use it, either.)

[softestbullet]

+1!

[azurelunatic]

I'm perfectly fine with the idea of there being a URL argument to go to a page with the cut version of the single entry, but every time I think about the base URL for the entry being the cut version and not the full version, my head goes into irrational screaming heebie-jeebies that return a "no", and I can't make much more sense of it than that. So no.

[triadruid]

Pretty much what Azz said.

[msilverstar]

I'd hate to have another click to see the contents, definitely bad for me. -1

[ciaan]

I think the plain URL ought to show the full entry. But I would be fine with some other way of showing the entry with cut-tags in. (As yes, many people use them poorly and include important info only in the cut-tag text.)

[the_shoshanna]

The cut=true option would be fine, but I absolutely want the plain entry URL to go to the plain entry.

Addressesing the requester's comment:

my friendslist is a filter, so it stays nicely uncluttered, but it'd be nice to go to an entry with multiple cut tags and be able to navigate from the 1st one to the 5th one without the gymnastics of finding an easy filter for that page so I can read the text of the cut tags OR remembering the order of the cut tags so I can slip the right number into the URL.

if you're looking at your dreamroll/friendslist, and see an entry with multiple cuts that you want to explore, you can open it in a new tab or window. Then the text of the cut tags, etc., is all still right there in the original tab or window for easy reference.

[cleverthylacine]

...why would you want to make people click after they have already opened an entry?

No.

If this is implemented as a non-default option I would be okay with it but I probably wouldn't read someone's journal if they were in the habit of doing this unless they had amazingly awesome cut tags. I don't even like it when people link to things with "cutid" at the end--I want to open pages from the top every time, so that if there are warnings at the top I see those first.

-100

[pauamma]

Unless I'm mistaken, most browsers implement URLs with fragment identifiers (such as http://libitina.dreamwidth.org/311800.html#cutid1) by retrieving the URL without the fragment identifier (http://libitina.dreamwidth.org/311800.html) from the server, then searching for <a name="cutid1"> in the retrieved HTML. So the specific method you suggest wouldn't work, because the server wouldn't know the difference. I like the idea, though.